Author , singer, poet Maya Angelou Once said “Everything in the universe has a rhythm, everything dances. “
The flow of a conversation when in sync can be like a dance, one of harmony and ease. But the moment you stop, that disconnect can leave you in a moment of wondering,
The skill of being able to adapt can help bring back flow into dynamic dance like movement.This combined with insight and knowledge of the other helps establish rapport.
Knowing your target audiences needs, desires and problems can help you, help them solve their issues and get what they want. It becomes a win win situation. Understanding others is key to connecting both on an offline.
Join me on this journey as we talk to world renowned transformational trainer, Marcia Martin, as she shares how to match reality, communicate and connect with others to build rapport.
In this podcast we cover:
- What is rapport?
- Is synchronously an aspect of rapport?
- Who creates the rapport?
- When meeting people is rapport the first thing that needs to be built?
- Whats the process to build rapport?
- How to pick up on whats going on
- What strengthens rapport?
- The importance of knowing your target market
- Being able to adapt to be in flow
- Coming from a place of service
Jatinder: Hello, my name is Jatinder, welcome to another digital report master series and I’ve just been on a three day public speaking course, with a lady is considered to be the godmother of personal development. And her name is Marcia Martin. So Martia. Thank you very much. Firstly for taking the time out, your busy schedule to do this interview with us and I’m just so that the view is know who you are. I just feel free to just let them know why you’re considered to be the god mother of personal development.
Marcia: I hope that it’s not because I’m so old. No, because of my experience in my background. I was one of the original founding members of an organization called est, which became landmark and was the largest personal development company in the world. Training millions and millions of people. I co-created the transformational leadership council with Jack Canfield, my dear friend. So I’ve been in the realm and domain and industry of transformation and transformational leadership my whole life. So I’m one of the, the ones I guess you could come to and ask questions of and I’ll have something to say.
Jatinder: Absolutely. That’s one of the things I’ve learned in industry is that if you want to learn something, you go to the masters, you go to the people who’ve done it before and they’re the people that I give you like the source of knowledge and that is very, very important considering the amount of junk that’s already out there at the moment. So it’s, it’s a privilege and honor to do so much. Thank you. And um, so I was telling that we’re working on a project called digital report and one of the things we’re exploring that is the whole concept of report. So from your experience, what would you say is rapport?
Marcia: Wow, that’s a big one. I think what I would say, there are some aspects of rapport and they include, if you understand someone, you have the same kind of reality that they do. If you can communicate well with them and have some kind of a connection and if you like each other. Right? So I would say affinity, reality and communication. When those three things and I would include connection with communication are in. Then we say we have rapport, and I’ve noticed it’s, it’s a nice little triangle. You can use this a trick because if you notice when people’s report breaks down, one of those three things is out. So if I stopped talking to you for over a period of time, we just didn’t have any communication and connection. What we would discover is we would kind of like each other a little less. We wouldn’t be as excited about each other and our realities might change. Okay, and if you and I had a breakdown or an upset, that’s usually a break in reality. So you see the world one way and I see the world another way, so I’ve got a different reality than then that’s creates an upset. I think I’m right. You think you’re right. We both try to make each other wrong. Well, if that break happens and you’ll notice you don’t want to talk to that person anymore so communication and connection goes and also connection goes right and affinity Stop Liking that person as much.
Jatinder: Would you say that on some level that when you’re communicating one to one with someone, there’s an element of a type of synchronicity where you are trying to be very similar to each other. Would you say that that’s an aspect of it or.
Marcia: I wouldn’t exactly Jatinder say it that way because it’s not like you try to copy someone. I know that there are a lot of techniques, you know, look like sound like be like someone else and then that’s true. There’s a bit of that if you’re like someone else, but I think it’s more that if you understand their reality and if you’re present so you can connect and communicate and if you’re willing to tolerate somebody else’s point of view,. Something happens where people go, oh, I like you. And again, we come back to reality. Affinity communication and what I think is interesting. Just like I said, if one of those goes out, they all go out. Yeah. Know if you stopped liking each somebody, for example, we already looked at communication reality, but if you stopped your affinity pretty soon you wouldn’t communicate and you would have a different sense of what was the way the world worked.
Marcia: Right? Right. Yeah. This is what I love about this particular triangle is if then you know that those are the three legs, then all you have to do is put one back in and the other two will follow. So if I can find a way not to be like you, like you were saying, but more to understand your reality and see it from your point of view and tolerate that and allow myself to consider it’s possible to look at the world that way and let you know that I have the same reality issue. Suddenly that personal like you more and then you’ll start communicating.
Jatinder: Okay. So do you think then, um, when you are communicating with someone, um, who, who would you say would be the person to actually create the report? Would you say is the person that makes the initial contact or the person you’re speaking with or what dynamic is actually going on in that moment in time to say where the report is coming from, if that makes sense.
Marcia: Thank you. I think it’s a process of kind of an exchange, like a dance. Now I do think that some people are more skilled and communication skills. I’ve been working in this area my whole life, so I can tell when a person is afraid or not confident or shy or upset and I can tease them out and through that and then they can feel good and then that’s kind of like I’m in the same reality that they are. I see the world, you know, that I kind of saw that. Then they feel better. If they had those same skill sets, they could probably do that with me. So I think you can lead and I think it’s also something happens and if you’re aware, most people aren’t aware. That’s a sad case. You know, most people are kind of asleep and hello, anybody in there so they don’t even notice really.
Marcia: There is rapport isn’t and make all sorts of blunders and mistakes, so I think that being present and being aware as a big part of it because then you know, by looking and seeing how is my communication landing, is this person opening like a flower opens, is this person retracting and contracting and going back and you know, hiding like a turtle does sometimes. Well then you know, to dance back and forth and bring them out and then that safety in that space, people end up saying, wow, I really liked this person or I can communicate with them and I can connect and they see things like I do, or they understand how I see things. So then we say, oh, we have rapport.
Jatinder: Right. Would you say that when you’re communicating with people, like when you first time meet people, meet people for the first time, would you say that rapport is like the first thing that needs to be built? Um, what, what are your thoughts on that? Or.
Marcia: I think the first thing that needs to be built as an understanding that I even recognize that you exist. Right? And I think that’s a piece of rapport. So I don’t think rapport is one of those things where you build that and then you do something else. I think rapport is something where you start with one little piece of sand and then pretty soon you have a beach. So it’s the whole process along in terms of your report deepens. It widens, it expands. But I think the first entry into rapport is that someone gets a sense that you see them. I love Avatar in the movie where it says, I see you, because that is true. Most human beings walk by other human beings. And even when people say hello, they say hello. It’s like, Eh, they don’t really connect to say, Hey, I recognize you’re there. I want you to know I’m here to and greetings. Right? So I think that piece of just recognizing somebody exists in space and time and that you honor them, whatever their point of view is, or whatever their belief is, that’s the beginning.
Jatinder: If you were to, um, teach people the process of rapport, if they say these are the kind of steps you would take to initiate it, what would you say those steps are how would that work if somebody wanted to approach someone and talk to someone or where does it begin to do that? Do you have the courage to go up to someone first or what happens in that process to start the whole report?
Marcia: Well definitely thank you for that question. I definitely think that there is some kind of courage involved because if you’re going to have rapport, you have to have some kind of a connection. You have to be with the person and Even if you’re silent, you can still be communicating. People have rapport across a room just looking into each other’s eyes sometimes and you just know, I like this person. I want to be with this person. I’d like to know more about this person, but I think it starts with presence. Am I willing to be in present time? And I have noticed when people are together, there’s a lot of talk going on, but not much presence. In fact, if you listen to people talk to each other, someone will ask a question, someone will answer with a different answer to a different question and nobody even notices and they keep on talking so people just aren’t home.
Marcia: So I think that’s a big part of rapport. You have to be here and you know, people have all sorts of excuses for not being here. I have a stomach ache. You know, I had a bad night, I had bad dreams. I the weather is bad outside. I just came from traffic. It’s like silliness. But we have the capacity to determine if we’re going to be in present time. Most people think that the way that you get into present time, is, if something is interesting and that draws you into present time. So we give the job the responsibility of being present to something outside of ourselves. That’s very irresponsible. I can be present if I choose to be present and if I’m going to have rapport with someone, got to start there. And then I would say the second step is space. So things get filled up, people get filled up, they have emotions, they have thoughts, they have concerns, things are happening in the world and all sorts of.
Marcia: There’s stuff going on and it’s kind of like a cloudy day, you know, it’s not clear. It’s not open, it’s not, there’s no space. So I think the ability to listen, to be there with someone and let them share and receive them, not try to say, oh, you shouldn’t feel like that. Oh well no, I have a different opinion. We’re so used to rebutting so quickly, but to actually just like enjoy the person and let them flow for a while to get a sense of them that, that opening up the space for them is another big beginning for establishing rapport.
Jatinder: Okay. So you said presence is the first thing and then this space. All right, so just I’m noticing what’s going on kind of stuff. Yeah. And then, as you noticing, then to be able to pick up on whatever that person is doing or going through and then having a conversation or thoughts around that is that, how about that? Right.
Marcia: And a big part of that as your capacity and ability and competence and listening, listening mostly to people is hearing words. Sounds,. I’m listening with my ear listening to me as a deeper thing. Listening is being with you in such a way that I actually recreate or duplicate your experience instead of trying to change it. I get it the way it is. I actually listen and I allow you enough time to give it to me. I don’t come in in the middle and say, oh, I got that and respond. I really give you some space to share.
Jatinder: That’s it. That’s pretty cool. I just wanted to show them that side of it is that. I remember the first time we actually met and uh, as I was when you were speaking at the yes group, I ended up, um, I had, uh, I think he just approached me and, um, you put your hand on my back and it was really strange. It was like, um, it was like a, um, it’s quite energetic and I was like, Ooh, what’s that? And so on. But as I turned around, it was just, it was really cool because, um, it was used as a hello, here I am. That’s how it felt right when I, when I spoke to you. So, but my response to that inside was genius. Seriously. And that was one of the things which I thought that was almost for me, it was almost like instant rapport. And I wanted to ask you about what are you, what is there something else you’re doing in that moment as well too? Um, because that, that seemed a lot deeper than just the, you know, presence because it was like instant.
Marcia: Well, you have to understand, I’ve been working on my own capacity to be present and see people and have rapport and communicate and connect my whole life, so now it’s kind of in my dna and there’s a part of me that just knows where to go, what to say, what to do, what not to say, and I love the idea of touch touching people because it’s a beautiful thing to connect and I know when I’m in a seminar and there’s someone that’s in trouble or they’re crying or they’re upset about something and I can feel that they’re trying to hold it in and I’ll go up behind them and just kinda rub their shoulders a bit. Or if you’re a girl, sometimes I. I love stroking hair and so many people have come up to me and said, when you did that, I just melted. But I think it’s the way that I touch because it’s. It’s, it’s a, Hey, I’m here. I recognize you. I’m not just pushing you or pulling you. I’m saying, Hey, I get that you take up space and you’re real and you’re human and you exists. For me and, and I, that’s a beautiful thing and I want to connect with you and say hi,
Jatinder: so that. That sounds as if there’s an element of you which is a very caring for the individual. Um, so it, and, and like what you’re sharing with that, when you do that, it seems as if it makes the person feel as if they are appreciated. They loved that, the cared for. Um, and would you say that strengthens the rapport between people? What’s your take on that?
Marcia: I think that has a lot to do with it. I mean, if you think about yourself and how good it feels to be loved, to be acknowledged, to be affirmed, to have someone appreciate you. We all have that feeling. You know, if somebody comes up to you and says you did a great job, there’s something where you go, thank you. Yeah. So we want to be loved. And the other side of that is being able to love. So, you know, a lot of people look at other people and they see a personality, they see a particular quirk, they see a color, they see a height thing. I don’t really see that. I look a little deeper and I see who you are in terms of a possibility. I love people, I just think they’re delicious and a lot of people are upset or angry or cruel. They, they’re, they’re going through parts of their life where they’re not being their biggest self. But I think if I can be with them while they’re being, they’re smaller self and kind of receive them and have it be okay that if that’s the way they want to express themselves, it’s their choice that they somehow get that. And then for some magical reason they turn a little bit more into their bigger self.
Jatinder: Right, right. So what I’m getting from that is a, is a sense of you. Um, whats the word, almost like understanding their need, would you say, is that understanding where they are, what they require and therefore adapting yourself to help them with that, would you say?
Marcia: Well, I would say that it’s not something that I think about. Yeah, so I didn’t go, oh, I understand you and now I can see her need and here I’m going to help you. That’s not what happens. It’s a more whole experience where I’m just with you and I see you and then something happens. Right But that ability to be with you is the rapport. So people feel safe around me. They have fun. Even if I push them, they seem to say do it more. It feels good because they trust me and I think a deep part of that is I understand them and not understand them in terms of I understand what they’re thinking, but understand them in terms of that. I know them. Yeah. There’s something about us that’s the same and if we can relate to that piece, usually people relate to each other about what’s different.
Jatinder: So did. I’m glad you mentioned that because one of the things, the whole exploration of the whole digital rapport side of it is that whole case about know your market. So you know, you’ve just led to that point. Do you say that you need to know the people you’re talking with, what their needs are, where they are, what they’re going through so that you can support them in overcoming that. I’m growing from there. Um, so, so that’s really cool. So, um, so if, if we, um, in those kinds of situations that’s more like relationships with people. Yeah. So if you will, uh, for example, in a kind of sales environment where you’re going to be selling, for example, how does rapport work in this situation? Or how does it change? Or does it change or does the same thing or
Marcia: Well, I think you opened up a huge topic that maybe we do another interview on, but I will say I have a philosophy that includes whether you’re selling or not selling. Yes. I kind of look at life that I’m flowing down this river. Yep. And along the river there’s going to be different kinds of flowers and trees and rocks and animals and people. And if I can appreciate and be grateful for , as I flow, something happens, the flowers grow faster, the animals are all excited and kind of wave. And say hello, the people feel safe if there’s something that goes along with, if I’m flowing, it’s not that I have a procedure or a process or a, a uh, something that I’ve got one, two, three, this is what I’m going to do and then I’m going to have a rapport. It’s that I’m in my flow, I come from myself, I know who I am and who I am is present.
Marcia: I’m not a lazy person and I’m not irresponsible. So I do be present and then I look over and I see someone and I see the part of them that’s like me. I see the part of them that’s whole. I don’t see the part that’s missing or wrong or all of that. I could look there if I wanted to, but it’s just not where I’m, where I’m attracted to looking. And when I see that part of them where there’s a connection and in that connection the person knows I know them and there’s something magical that happens. And then we call that rapport. Okay.
Jatinder: So it’s almost like, as bruce lee says be like water, like adapting and going with the flow. And just seeing how that goes. So that’s, that’s really interesting. That’s one of the other points is when, when it’s like one to one communication there is a such a, like a group of things that happened in terms of like body language, what the present energy is, how they’re feeling. You could see all of that stuff, right? You could physically see it and therefore to be able to serve them, it’s a lot easier. Right? So just baring that in mind if one of the things that we’re covering digital report is about, okay, what is rapport, how does it work? And then how do we then translate that online, for example? Yeah. So, but in the situation or online you don’t meet your audience, you don’t see them necessarily unless you’re on skype or something. Right? But which, but if you’re in a situation scenario when you don’t know what you have to do in a way or who you’re connecting with or anything like that, how, how would you use the adaptability there? How would you.
Marcia: Well, I go back to even online. The biggest skill set you have is listening. I mean, I know I’m doing a lot of talking now because you’re asking me questions and when I’m in a seminar I talk a lot because I’m the person facilitating, but mostly in life I’m just very still and quiet because everybody has something to say and not many people listen, so if you can find a way to incorporate online, that’s where this whole capacity to be able to listen. Listen, it’s not what’s said, it’s what’s heard that really is a funk. The result is a function of what’s heard not, what’s said.
Jatinder: Yep. So it goes back to that whole thing about knowing your audience. Yeah, that’s true. So where they are, where they hang out with all that kind of stuff. That’s just really amazing. To summarize then on the whole thing about rapport, you’re saying that the first thing is presence. Yeah. Then you’re saying space
Marcia: present. Not present. Like I have so much presence and charisma, but presence and I’m present your present. We’re in present time. We’re here now.
Jatinder: Okay. And then the second thing you said was space. Space. Okay. And that’s about understanding where they are, what they’re up to, that kind of thing. Yeah.
Marcia: Yeah. Space is a big, big conversation. Spaces. People have a lot going on with themselves. They have upsets and they have concerns and they have considerations and they have breakdowns and they have family problems and they have money problems and they have, what am I going to do? Problems and questions and all of those things are, you know, they don’t just stop because you came and said hello. So it’s what I say is there kind of filled up and I’m filled up lots of times too, so I have to be able to notice if it’s. Is it a time when I listen and with quality listening, not just, you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. But really being with someone and in that listening, what’s going to happen is that person’s going to get that I know them, that I understand them, that I have the same reality that I see them. And that’s going to be a magical thing for rapport. So that all includes space
Jatinder: that all includes space. Okay. So that space element of it includes the listening side of it as well. Okay. And then after the listening, it’s a case of adapting.
Marcia: Well, I think it’s a case of dancing. Dancing. Okay. So still everyone wants to put it in a one, two, three, which I know you have to do because you’re creating courses and we have to know like at least let’s start here, but I think if you tell people that I’m starting here now to teach you something about this particular aspect of it, presence or space or listening, but it’s not that one comes first and then one comes second and then one comes third. Sure. Because who knows what’s out there. That’s right. Yeah. It’s a dance and I. I think if somebody wants to establish rapport, they should take tango lessons because there’s more knowledge and how you throw a partner, catch a partner, pull them back, lead them, be led by them. It is a dance out there, I think. And if I can dance with you, I’m going to have rapport. If you throw me across the room and don’t catch me, I’m going to la next you say so there’s something in that metaphor I think.
Jatinder: Yeah, no, no, I understand because it’s like I’m a bruce lee had this concept as well, of energy. So when, when he was in a bottle, for example, depending on what was going on, he would adapt. So if they were throwing a punch who move with a, it was almost like a dance, like what you just said. So it makes sense from that side of it. Um, okay. So, uh, what would you say is the next step then after that or what happens after that? So because report then once you’ve got that rapport, pretty much opens you up for better relationships, better communication, collaboration, whatever needs to be done.
Marcia: I think the next step in all aspects of life, whether it’s rapport or whether it’s sales that you were saying or whether it’s relationships is to be concerned for what that person needs for themselves. Not what I can give to them. You know, everybody wants to give an answer to somebody else, but where I come from is everyone has their own answer. So how I can be of service and support to someone is to assist them in finding their answer. Well, if I’m going to assist them in finding their answer, I can have my own agenda about what the answer is. Yes. So especially in sales, it’s like you’re saying most people are trying to talk you into buying something. What I do when I’m making an offer is I have people look to see if it’s something that they want. What do they care if I think they need it you say, but if I can find out if they think they want it or need it or can afford it, then I know what to do next.
Marcia: I can tell them how to get it. And if they say they don’t want it, I should be able to tolerate their reality and appreciated and respected and honor it and say, okay, fine. Well if anything changes, call me. Yeah. Yeah. So it’s that kind of. I’m really looking to see what’s. So for you and being able to share what’s so for me in a way that I’m not trying to push what, so for me on you, but I’m trying to express it so that we have something where we can say, oh, we’re dancing. Yeah.
Jatinder: Yeah. And it makes sense because I know, I know from the communication we have had that you. You come from a place of service to serving others. Um, and that’s basically just led to that to say how can I serve you? And then you basically help them out with what they ever they need help with. So it makes sense on that side. So I think, um, uh, I really appreciate your time and I’m in a, what you shared with me. Are there any final thoughts that you want to just share with the audience?
Marcia: Um, I would share with the audience to have fun. Have Fun. Yeah. Everybody talks about rapport and communication and sales and all of these things as if it’s a tedious task and it’s kind of a lot of work, but you know, bing with people and being in present time and sharing with people. And sharing your experience, it’s could be fun, so I would add that.
Jatinder: Okay. And if anybody wants to get in contact with you, what do they need to do?
Marcia: I am @ my website is www.MarciaMartin.com And my email is Marsha at Marsha Martin Dot Com and I would love for you to contact me or find out about my work.
Jatinder: Okay. Marcia thank you very much for your time. Thank you. Really appreciate it. So I hope you guys enjoyed that , see we have report. Yes, absolutely. Absolutely. have fun.
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